Comments on: Spiritual gifts and authority http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/ This blog is for dialogue on the issue of women in ministry and the freedom for women to teach the bible in a public setting. It is also for questions and answers on our DVD entitled "Women in Ministry: Silenced or Set Free?" This 4 DVD set answers the hard passages of scripture that seem to restrict women's ministry. Sat, 11 Oct 2008 12:06:01 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.1 By: Cheryl http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1827 Cheryl Fri, 02 Nov 2007 04:56:48 +0000 http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1827 Charis, I do not use the word "heretic" lightly as many do in the church. In this case I would use the word "deceived" because Rick has not chosen to test his visions by the word of God. This is the same thing that happened to our former youth pastor. His visions contradicted scripture but he refused to let anyone test them against scripture because he was so enthralled by the power that the spirits in his vision gave him that he could not for a minute think that a Christian could receive visions from anyone else but God. The fact is that many people claiming to be Christians have received visions that contradict scripture. Scripture tells us to test all things and visions are part of the "all things" that are to be tested by the measuring stick of God's word. Unfortunately there are Christians who are easily led by strong leaders who also see those leaders as a type of god who is not to be questioned. Unfortunately that is how I see Matt's followers. They do not question Matt and the ones who do get censored. That is how the cults keep their people unified. They insist on conformity and they kick out any who question the leaders right to rule. Keep testing all things like you have been. Don't hold to anyone's leadership without testing them by God's inspired word. Charis,

I do not use the word “heretic” lightly as many do in the church. In this case I would use the word “deceived” because Rick has not chosen to test his visions by the word of God. This is the same thing that happened to our former youth pastor. His visions contradicted scripture but he refused to let anyone test them against scripture because he was so enthralled by the power that the spirits in his vision gave him that he could not for a minute think that a Christian could receive visions from anyone else but God. The fact is that many people claiming to be Christians have received visions that contradict scripture. Scripture tells us to test all things and visions are part of the “all things” that are to be tested by the measuring stick of God’s word.

Unfortunately there are Christians who are easily led by strong leaders who also see those leaders as a type of god who is not to be questioned. Unfortunately that is how I see Matt’s followers. They do not question Matt and the ones who do get censored. That is how the cults keep their people unified. They insist on conformity and they kick out any who question the leaders right to rule.

Keep testing all things like you have been. Don’t hold to anyone’s leadership without testing them by God’s inspired word.

]]> By: Charis http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1815 Charis Thu, 01 Nov 2007 12:35:53 +0000 http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1815 Dear Cheryl, Having been what you have just been through at the hands of "brothers and sisters in Christ" I wish you would re-consider what Rick Joyner has written. I know you had a run in involving your beloved daughter and the mama bear comes out, but I don't think you should cross him off as "dangerous" and a "heretic". (You know how that feels now. ) I did not read all of this, but if you have a minute, skim a few paragraphs and see if you can understand what he is trying to communicate about the condition of the church: <a href="http://www.spiritlessons.com/Documents/The_Final_Quest/the_final_quest_vision_rick_joyner.htm" rel="nofollow">The Final Quest</a> The church has an enemy and it is not those fellow Christians with whom we disagree. Dear Cheryl,
Having been what you have just been through at the hands of “brothers and sisters in Christ” I wish you would re-consider what Rick Joyner has written. I know you had a run in involving your beloved daughter and the mama bear comes out, but I don’t think you should cross him off as “dangerous” and a “heretic”. (You know how that feels now. ) I did not read all of this, but if you have a minute, skim a few paragraphs and see if you can understand what he is trying to communicate about the condition of the church:
The Final Quest

The church has an enemy and it is not those fellow Christians with whom we disagree.

]]> By: Cheryl http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1731 Cheryl Mon, 29 Oct 2007 16:14:50 +0000 http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1731 Charis, I agree that it is time that we all grow up. We really do need all of us in the body of Christ to benefit from all of our gifts. If we refuse to learn from someone just because they are not of our race or because they are not of our gender or because they are not of our social class, then we are missing out on what God has supplied for our growth. The body needs to grow together so that it isn't lopsided. Everyone is needed and maturity is needed. Charis, I agree that it is time that we all grow up. We really do need all of us in the body of Christ to benefit from all of our gifts. If we refuse to learn from someone just because they are not of our race or because they are not of our gender or because they are not of our social class, then we are missing out on what God has supplied for our growth. The body needs to grow together so that it isn’t lopsided. Everyone is needed and maturity is needed.

]]> By: Charis http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1725 Charis Mon, 29 Oct 2007 15:30:11 +0000 http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1725 I think the church is full of children in adult bodies. Its a product of the times... the sexualized culture, last days, lots of abusiveness by "authority figures". As children, they got wounded by those in authority and they get stuck and have "authority issues".... and "the sins of the fathers are visited upon the children..." I've been there. I was blind. Here is the way out: "The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints, and what is the exceeding greatness of his power toward us who believe" Eph 1:18-19 I think the church is full of children in adult bodies. Its a product of the times… the sexualized culture, last days, lots of abusiveness by “authority figures”. As children, they got wounded by those in authority and they get stuck and have “authority issues”…. and “the sins of the fathers are visited upon the children…”

I’ve been there. I was blind.
Here is the way out:
“The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints, and what is the exceeding greatness of his power toward us who believe” Eph 1:18-19

]]> By: Greg Anderson http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1697 Greg Anderson Thu, 25 Oct 2007 16:56:47 +0000 http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1697 Cheryl and Kerryn, I think that they (church governments) don't "get it" because they feel that men (anthropos) must be governed. They must be led by their betters. If men must be governed, then it follows that all aspects of church life must be regulated, even the exercise of spiritual gifts. In effect they are following the world's model of authority. Never mind that it's God who gives the gifts in the first place, we'll (church leadership) decide how they'll be used. Cheryl and Kerryn, I think that they (church governments) don’t “get it” because they feel that men (anthropos) must be governed. They must be led by their betters. If men must be governed, then it follows that all aspects of church life must be regulated, even the exercise of spiritual gifts. In effect they are following the world’s model of authority. Never mind that it’s God who gives the gifts in the first place, we’ll (church leadership) decide how they’ll be used.

]]> By: Kerryn http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1694 Kerryn Thu, 25 Oct 2007 11:55:04 +0000 http://strivetoenter.com/wim/2007/10/25/spiritual-gifts-and-authority/#comment-1694 Hey Cheryl Clear, succint and profound. It's so sad that this seems so hard for the Body to 'get' and live out in practice? Thanks. Kerryn Hey Cheryl
Clear, succint and profound.
It’s so sad that this seems so hard for the Body to ‘get’ and live out in practice?
Thanks.
Kerryn

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